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	<title>Comments on: Rare English map of 1829 shows Skopje Out of Macedonia</title>
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	<link>http://history-of-macedonia.com/wordpress/2008/09/14/rare-english-map-of-1829-shows-skopje-out-of-macedonia/</link>
	<description>Macedonian Online Journal focusing on the History of Macedonia through ages and also dealing with the propaganda emanating from the Former Yugoslav Republic Of Macedonia (FYROM)  - Ιστολόγιο που εστιάζεται στην Ιστορία της Μακεδονίας μέσα στους αιώνες</description>
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		<title>By: Nick Nikolas</title>
		<link>http://history-of-macedonia.com/wordpress/2008/09/14/rare-english-map-of-1829-shows-skopje-out-of-macedonia/comment-page-1/#comment-2887</link>
		<dc:creator>Nick Nikolas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 19 Apr 2009 13:13:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://history-of-macedonia.com/wordpress/?p=664#comment-2887</guid>
		<description>Greece  was not a country.  Greece was the union of all civilized countries.  If there were countries being not part of Greece is that they did not have the necessary civilization to be part of Greece.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Greece  was not a country.  Greece was the union of all civilized countries.  If there were countries being not part of Greece is that they did not have the necessary civilization to be part of Greece.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: dimitar</title>
		<link>http://history-of-macedonia.com/wordpress/2008/09/14/rare-english-map-of-1829-shows-skopje-out-of-macedonia/comment-page-1/#comment-2874</link>
		<dc:creator>dimitar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 Apr 2009 19:38:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://history-of-macedonia.com/wordpress/?p=664#comment-2874</guid>
		<description>J don*t look GREECE on the MAP</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>J don*t look GREECE on the MAP</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Manolis</title>
		<link>http://history-of-macedonia.com/wordpress/2008/09/14/rare-english-map-of-1829-shows-skopje-out-of-macedonia/comment-page-1/#comment-2557</link>
		<dc:creator>Manolis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Mar 2009 15:43:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://history-of-macedonia.com/wordpress/?p=664#comment-2557</guid>
		<description>In relation to the video shown here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZwgl9-G00Q  (yorg0 has put the link) I noticed something else: in addition to all the greek names written in cyrillic, we can see that Nikola Tesla (the serb scientist and inventor) is a &quot;macedonian&quot; himself! FYROMian transformation has no ending at all!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In relation to the video shown here <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZwgl9-G00Q" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZwgl9-G00Q</a>  (yorg0 has put the link) I noticed something else: in addition to all the greek names written in cyrillic, we can see that Nikola Tesla (the serb scientist and inventor) is a &#8220;macedonian&#8221; himself! FYROMian transformation has no ending at all!</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Dimitrios</title>
		<link>http://history-of-macedonia.com/wordpress/2008/09/14/rare-english-map-of-1829-shows-skopje-out-of-macedonia/comment-page-1/#comment-2547</link>
		<dc:creator>Dimitrios</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Mar 2009 17:20:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://history-of-macedonia.com/wordpress/?p=664#comment-2547</guid>
		<description>@ &quot;Real Macedonian&quot; TROLL

Keep up amusing us ... :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ &#8220;Real Macedonian&#8221; TROLL</p>
<p>Keep up amusing us &#8230; <img src='http://history-of-macedonia.com/wordpress/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: REAL Macedonian</title>
		<link>http://history-of-macedonia.com/wordpress/2008/09/14/rare-english-map-of-1829-shows-skopje-out-of-macedonia/comment-page-1/#comment-2539</link>
		<dc:creator>REAL Macedonian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Mar 2009 00:36:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://history-of-macedonia.com/wordpress/?p=664#comment-2539</guid>
		<description>LOL -- maybe skopje is not in macedonia in this map, but many more ARE :-)))

especially you may see river pchinja which is on this map whole in macedonia, but in today&#039;s maps its springs are in serbia - that far north.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>LOL &#8212; maybe skopje is not in macedonia in this map, but many more ARE <img src='http://history-of-macedonia.com/wordpress/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> ))</p>
<p>especially you may see river pchinja which is on this map whole in macedonia, but in today&#8217;s maps its springs are in serbia &#8211; that far north.</p>
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		<title>By: Alexandra the Great Greek</title>
		<link>http://history-of-macedonia.com/wordpress/2008/09/14/rare-english-map-of-1829-shows-skopje-out-of-macedonia/comment-page-1/#comment-2476</link>
		<dc:creator>Alexandra the Great Greek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Mar 2009 01:30:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://history-of-macedonia.com/wordpress/?p=664#comment-2476</guid>
		<description>Detecting Propaganda and Propaganda Techniques. 
A propagandist tries to influence your thinking or behavior and turn your opinions and actions in a certain direction. He or She uses words that appeal to your emotions- your fears, your loves, your hates-rather than to your reason, to your ability to think clearly in order, ultimately, to make you do things in a way you never ordinarily would do.
 Six Common techniques in propaganda are:
1) Name Calling:  THE Slavs Attaching a bad name to Greece.
 Name calling is a common propaganda technique, that loads emotional overtones.
2)  Glittering Generalities: The FYO Vardarska Stilling the History and the Name of the Greek Ancient Macedonia, by Naming their country &quot;Macedonia&quot; to be accepted in the world as a Great Nation, Hoping that You will NOT look into the facts.A smart reader will ask questions, and read reliable information about the Great Ancient Macedonia who is 5000BC GREEK.
3) Transfer:  THE FYO Vardarska  want the world to think of them as prestige, By using the  stolen name &quot;Macedonia&quot; where we Greeks love  and respect our Nation, where they  want  the world  to accept that it is OK to still  Your neighbors identity and  Land.
4)Testimonials: Advertising stolen GREEK  History and land, that it is theirs, and they are the creators of this Great Historical Land instead the  Greeks who shed their blood to save the Great Macedonia from its enemies. They get paid to lie.
5)Card stocking: The FYO Vardarska want you to see only one side of the Macedonian name Issue. They use 1/2 truth and 1/2 lies to confuse the world.
6) Bandwagon: The FY OF Vardarska want  its readers to go alone with their crowd. Since most people are followers, and do not want you to think clearly.
YOU SHOULD ALWAYS ASK WHY! AND EXAMINE THE PERSON, THE NATION THE POLITICS, THE HISTORY, READ RELIABLE INFORMATION, SO YOUR EMOTIONS
 GET THE BEST OF YOU.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Detecting Propaganda and Propaganda Techniques.<br />
A propagandist tries to influence your thinking or behavior and turn your opinions and actions in a certain direction. He or She uses words that appeal to your emotions- your fears, your loves, your hates-rather than to your reason, to your ability to think clearly in order, ultimately, to make you do things in a way you never ordinarily would do.<br />
 Six Common techniques in propaganda are:<br />
1) Name Calling:  THE Slavs Attaching a bad name to Greece.<br />
 Name calling is a common propaganda technique, that loads emotional overtones.<br />
2)  Glittering Generalities: The FYO Vardarska Stilling the History and the Name of the Greek Ancient Macedonia, by Naming their country &#8220;Macedonia&#8221; to be accepted in the world as a Great Nation, Hoping that You will NOT look into the facts.A smart reader will ask questions, and read reliable information about the Great Ancient Macedonia who is 5000BC GREEK.<br />
3) Transfer:  THE FYO Vardarska  want the world to think of them as prestige, By using the  stolen name &#8220;Macedonia&#8221; where we Greeks love  and respect our Nation, where they  want  the world  to accept that it is OK to still  Your neighbors identity and  Land.<br />
4)Testimonials: Advertising stolen GREEK  History and land, that it is theirs, and they are the creators of this Great Historical Land instead the  Greeks who shed their blood to save the Great Macedonia from its enemies. They get paid to lie.<br />
5)Card stocking: The FYO Vardarska want you to see only one side of the Macedonian name Issue. They use 1/2 truth and 1/2 lies to confuse the world.<br />
6) Bandwagon: The FY OF Vardarska want  its readers to go alone with their crowd. Since most people are followers, and do not want you to think clearly.<br />
YOU SHOULD ALWAYS ASK WHY! AND EXAMINE THE PERSON, THE NATION THE POLITICS, THE HISTORY, READ RELIABLE INFORMATION, SO YOUR EMOTIONS<br />
 GET THE BEST OF YOU.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: VASILEIOS</title>
		<link>http://history-of-macedonia.com/wordpress/2008/09/14/rare-english-map-of-1829-shows-skopje-out-of-macedonia/comment-page-1/#comment-2413</link>
		<dc:creator>VASILEIOS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Feb 2009 22:14:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://history-of-macedonia.com/wordpress/?p=664#comment-2413</guid>
		<description>SLAVOALBANIANS ( MONKEYDONSKI) FROM DARDANIA (DARDANI-SKOPJANS), ANCIENT NAME SCUPI  , YOU SKOPJANS, ANCIENT DARDANIANS (THRACO-ILLYRIAN  TRIBE) USED TO BE THE WORSE ENEMIES OF ANCIENT MACEDONIANS ( DORIAN HELLENIC TRIBE) EXACTLY AS YOU ARE NOWDAYS, EVERYBODY SHOULD HAVE A LOOK HERE AND LEARN HISTORY :    
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dardania_(Europe)    .</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>SLAVOALBANIANS ( MONKEYDONSKI) FROM DARDANIA (DARDANI-SKOPJANS), ANCIENT NAME SCUPI  , YOU SKOPJANS, ANCIENT DARDANIANS (THRACO-ILLYRIAN  TRIBE) USED TO BE THE WORSE ENEMIES OF ANCIENT MACEDONIANS ( DORIAN HELLENIC TRIBE) EXACTLY AS YOU ARE NOWDAYS, EVERYBODY SHOULD HAVE A LOOK HERE AND LEARN HISTORY :<br />
<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dardania_(Europe)" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dardania_(Europe)</a>    .</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: westclub4</title>
		<link>http://history-of-macedonia.com/wordpress/2008/09/14/rare-english-map-of-1829-shows-skopje-out-of-macedonia/comment-page-1/#comment-1394</link>
		<dc:creator>westclub4</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Oct 2008 00:58:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://history-of-macedonia.com/wordpress/?p=664#comment-1394</guid>
		<description>Dear Bojan and readers, 

Indeed, ethnic cleansing and attrocities against all ethnic, linguistic and religious minorities is a crime against humanity that should become prohibited; That is also a crime against us all and irrespective to colour, gender, sexual preference, spoken language, nationality or national affiliation and ethnic culture. We shall not close our eyes before neither the crimes that were once commited by the Stalinists, nor to the crimes that were also done against them and during the same period, either. True, the ethnic Macedonian brothers of the north had been through a lot by the Greek Monarchists and by their fascist gangs, either of which we modern Greeks shall not be proud of. On the other hand, the Stalinist policies of the Comintern, which were to be followed to the &#039;jota&#039; by the numerous, yet also not politically experienced and &#039;premature&#039; CP&#039;s in the Balkans, at that time, has been disastrous for the liberating cause and for the socialist ideals, to say the least.

The Stalinist approach to the so-called &#039;national question&#039; in the Balkans of the time has been horrible and equally damaging for the fighters&#039; just cause, as well as for their humanistic ideals and for their anti-exploitative values and liberating demands. The Stalinist bureaucrats had already &#039;&#039;sold&#039;&#039; the democratic and the socialist worker and paesant freedom fighters back then and, yet, that is from either side of the border also, ever since they had signed the Yalta &#039;&#039;peace pact&#039;&#039; with western imperialism. The Greek Stalinists had signed their own Yalta &#039;&#039;sell out&#039;&#039; from the Kazerta and the Lebanon agreements, where they made concessions and signed treaties with the right-wingers and with the Greek ultra-nationalists, as well as when they signed of the so-called Varkiza Agreement with the local Greek bourgeoisie and with the Anglo-Americans, as well.

The Yugoslav Titoists (a local &#039;break-away&#039; Stalinist bureaucratic regime and state apparatus) &#039;&#039;cut&#039;&#039; the supplies to the Greek communists and fought them fiercefuly, as soon as they themselves broke with Stalinist Russia and with Zachariadis and his Stalinist Greek CP -i.e with the KKE. Yet, they accepted many slavophone ethnic Macedonian freedom fighters and Greek communists too, only to use them at some time in the future against the Greek pro-western bourgeoisie, as well as, against her conservative political elite. 

Ethnic Macedonian brothers of the north, it is not the Greeks who deserve to take the blame for all of your misfortunes and excile. Nor is it the communist workers&#039; and peasants&#039; fault, nor the fault of any of the other democratic and freedom fighters who fought along with your people for peace, for bread and for socialism, for the liberation of Greece and of the Macedonian region in particular, either. Indeed, at some point things got really messed up, so that reality had suddently turned against you. 

Nonetheless, we -i.e. the democratic Greeks and in particular Greek Communists and freedom fighters, had seen you as our true and real ethnic brothers and sisters back then. We still consider you that, even after all those years and even today. As far as the Greek freedom fighters&#039; movement is of any particular significance and of concerned to our discussion, it should be stated that we only wanted you to be our comrades in an all-out fight for creating from below a trully democratic society, which would also be free of oppression and of exploitation either -that is, for all of its peoples, as well. 

In particular, we wanted to assist to the historic and also humane task of saving you from the ultra-nationalist Bulgarian knife and from the south-Slavic and Greater Serbian nationalism, as well as from the Greek monarchists and from the Greek fascist bandits who were active and who operated in your communal areas. Furthermore, we wanted to live with you as equals. To live united together and in peace, as real comrades in arms deserve to live after they &#039;ve won the battle. We -i.e. the democratic Greeks and, in particular, the simple communist fighters, had very much respected (and also assisted) you and, indeed, by all the means that were available to us back then. 

We wanted you to attain your distinct ethnic culture, although that particular culture was indeed foreign to us Greeks and historic Macedonians, which was also perceived from us as to have been a forcefully imposed culture upon your people -that is, to say the least; In other words, we viewed your &#039;&#039;Slavic&#039;&#039; culture -and, we still to this date beleive we did so correctly at that time- as a foreign and not as an original and indigenous ethnic culture of your people, which has been none other than that of the former Bulgarian and Serbian oppressor and occupier of our Macedonian land. 

Indeed, this culture were once to become obtained by your great-great-grandparents at some particular time in history and were to be passed on to you in more recent times, mostly due to the lack of a proper or of an appropriate education system or, simply because of the many centuries of occupation of your land and of the significant oppression of your ethnic Macedonian people by the raiding Avaro-Slavs or by the invading Tataric-Bulgarians of past centuries. Moreover, we were being brought up to beleive that we are the only true ethnic Macedonians, since we are both Greek-speaking and also feeling Greek, likewise to our ancient and to historic Macedonian Greek forefathers. 

Today, it is about time to break with this foreign tradition to true Hellenism -i.e. the tradition of the monopolization of history and of absolute historic facts, of the monopolization of all ancient and significant cultures to that area of the Balkans and of the policy to turn a deaf ear to those who assume something different than that we already happen to know or have only learned to recognise, either.

Yours Sincerely,

Elias L.A.
Athens, Greece.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear Bojan and readers, </p>
<p>Indeed, ethnic cleansing and attrocities against all ethnic, linguistic and religious minorities is a crime against humanity that should become prohibited; That is also a crime against us all and irrespective to colour, gender, sexual preference, spoken language, nationality or national affiliation and ethnic culture. We shall not close our eyes before neither the crimes that were once commited by the Stalinists, nor to the crimes that were also done against them and during the same period, either. True, the ethnic Macedonian brothers of the north had been through a lot by the Greek Monarchists and by their fascist gangs, either of which we modern Greeks shall not be proud of. On the other hand, the Stalinist policies of the Comintern, which were to be followed to the &#8216;jota&#8217; by the numerous, yet also not politically experienced and &#8216;premature&#8217; CP&#8217;s in the Balkans, at that time, has been disastrous for the liberating cause and for the socialist ideals, to say the least.</p>
<p>The Stalinist approach to the so-called &#8216;national question&#8217; in the Balkans of the time has been horrible and equally damaging for the fighters&#8217; just cause, as well as for their humanistic ideals and for their anti-exploitative values and liberating demands. The Stalinist bureaucrats had already &#8221;sold&#8221; the democratic and the socialist worker and paesant freedom fighters back then and, yet, that is from either side of the border also, ever since they had signed the Yalta &#8221;peace pact&#8221; with western imperialism. The Greek Stalinists had signed their own Yalta &#8221;sell out&#8221; from the Kazerta and the Lebanon agreements, where they made concessions and signed treaties with the right-wingers and with the Greek ultra-nationalists, as well as when they signed of the so-called Varkiza Agreement with the local Greek bourgeoisie and with the Anglo-Americans, as well.</p>
<p>The Yugoslav Titoists (a local &#8216;break-away&#8217; Stalinist bureaucratic regime and state apparatus) &#8221;cut&#8221; the supplies to the Greek communists and fought them fiercefuly, as soon as they themselves broke with Stalinist Russia and with Zachariadis and his Stalinist Greek CP -i.e with the KKE. Yet, they accepted many slavophone ethnic Macedonian freedom fighters and Greek communists too, only to use them at some time in the future against the Greek pro-western bourgeoisie, as well as, against her conservative political elite. </p>
<p>Ethnic Macedonian brothers of the north, it is not the Greeks who deserve to take the blame for all of your misfortunes and excile. Nor is it the communist workers&#8217; and peasants&#8217; fault, nor the fault of any of the other democratic and freedom fighters who fought along with your people for peace, for bread and for socialism, for the liberation of Greece and of the Macedonian region in particular, either. Indeed, at some point things got really messed up, so that reality had suddently turned against you. </p>
<p>Nonetheless, we -i.e. the democratic Greeks and in particular Greek Communists and freedom fighters, had seen you as our true and real ethnic brothers and sisters back then. We still consider you that, even after all those years and even today. As far as the Greek freedom fighters&#8217; movement is of any particular significance and of concerned to our discussion, it should be stated that we only wanted you to be our comrades in an all-out fight for creating from below a trully democratic society, which would also be free of oppression and of exploitation either -that is, for all of its peoples, as well. </p>
<p>In particular, we wanted to assist to the historic and also humane task of saving you from the ultra-nationalist Bulgarian knife and from the south-Slavic and Greater Serbian nationalism, as well as from the Greek monarchists and from the Greek fascist bandits who were active and who operated in your communal areas. Furthermore, we wanted to live with you as equals. To live united together and in peace, as real comrades in arms deserve to live after they &#8216;ve won the battle. We -i.e. the democratic Greeks and, in particular, the simple communist fighters, had very much respected (and also assisted) you and, indeed, by all the means that were available to us back then. </p>
<p>We wanted you to attain your distinct ethnic culture, although that particular culture was indeed foreign to us Greeks and historic Macedonians, which was also perceived from us as to have been a forcefully imposed culture upon your people -that is, to say the least; In other words, we viewed your &#8221;Slavic&#8221; culture -and, we still to this date beleive we did so correctly at that time- as a foreign and not as an original and indigenous ethnic culture of your people, which has been none other than that of the former Bulgarian and Serbian oppressor and occupier of our Macedonian land. </p>
<p>Indeed, this culture were once to become obtained by your great-great-grandparents at some particular time in history and were to be passed on to you in more recent times, mostly due to the lack of a proper or of an appropriate education system or, simply because of the many centuries of occupation of your land and of the significant oppression of your ethnic Macedonian people by the raiding Avaro-Slavs or by the invading Tataric-Bulgarians of past centuries. Moreover, we were being brought up to beleive that we are the only true ethnic Macedonians, since we are both Greek-speaking and also feeling Greek, likewise to our ancient and to historic Macedonian Greek forefathers. </p>
<p>Today, it is about time to break with this foreign tradition to true Hellenism -i.e. the tradition of the monopolization of history and of absolute historic facts, of the monopolization of all ancient and significant cultures to that area of the Balkans and of the policy to turn a deaf ear to those who assume something different than that we already happen to know or have only learned to recognise, either.</p>
<p>Yours Sincerely,</p>
<p>Elias L.A.<br />
Athens, Greece.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: westclub4</title>
		<link>http://history-of-macedonia.com/wordpress/2008/09/14/rare-english-map-of-1829-shows-skopje-out-of-macedonia/comment-page-1/#comment-1393</link>
		<dc:creator>westclub4</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Oct 2008 22:53:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://history-of-macedonia.com/wordpress/?p=664#comment-1393</guid>
		<description>Dear ethnic Macedonian brother Bojan / dear fellow Greek readers / dear comrades in arms of the Hellenic Peninsula, 

Of course, it is about time that all ethnic minorities in contemporary Greece should have the right to declare themselves as they wish. I fully support their right to do so even though I &#039;d personaly disagree with the particular choise of the name that those minorities would chose for their own internal and cross-communal daily usage. Moreover, it is about time to understand that there are also many ethnic Macedonians who do not yet speak Greek or who do not speak Greek only and who also do not yet feel Greek at all. Indeed, some of them could even feel in opposition to Greece and to the contemporary Greek bourgeois&#039; state, which can also oppress them ethnically and socially, by its particular socio-economic way of life and by its politico-historical elite&#039;s aims and goals, as well as, propaganda and public information system.

It is about time that we modern Greeks see that there are slavophone ethnic Macedonians in our country, who do not feel Greek or Greek only yet. Although I am not one of them -and, not by any means, either- I fully appreciate and completely understand them and their particular need to collectively proclaim of themselves ethnically whatever they wish. It is their absolute democratic right to find a name of their chosing, in order to call themselves and also their community according to that. This is also despite of the fact that I would personaly disagree on scientific and on absolute socio-historic terms and  conditions with the name under perspective, i.e. Ethnic Macedonians.

The reason for my objection is that this is a tribal or an ethnic name, not a name of a nation. Indeed, it takes of more than one ethnic group of people to declare them a separate nation. It is by that token that I significantly object to the use of their ethnic name for stating of their nationality, as well. You cannot be an ethnic Macedonian and also not being a Greek as well -like in the old days. Equally, you cannot in nowadays be an ethnic Macedonian and also not being either a Greek or a Slav, be it either a Serbian Slav or a Bulgarian Slav, or a bit of both also.

Well, of course, one could be a slavophone ethnic Macedonian and yet not at all a Slav of whatever kind (that is, in nationality) or, indeed, one could also be a prime Greek-speaker and yet not at all Greek (also in nationality), either. Moreover, one could not be plain and simply a Macedonian for this is what he declares or because he simply beleives so. That is so, because being an ethnic Macedonian states only his tribal name (i.e. that is, only his ethnic name of birthplace and of origin, and yet nothing more) and not his proper nationality, nor his particular national culture either.

Indeed, it is true that throughout history Macedonia and, in particular Macedonian, were known to have been ethnic Greek names -one of the many tribal or ethnic Greek names that were to be used by the ancient and historic Greek tribes and, also for quite some time in the past. Practically, being a Macedonian did not mean that you were not Greek. As a matter of fact, the opposite was the case. Being a Macedonian in the past also meant that you were Greek, as well. The meaning of the adjective Macedonian has not been a national one but, only a tribal one or an ethnic name of a particular tribe, which belonged to a much larger nation. 
, 
That has been the case for many centuries before the Avaro-Slavs, the Tataro-Bulgarians, the Antes, the Vindes and the Vendes had ever set foot in the Hellenic Peninsula. When we say today ethnic Bulgarian or an ethnic Serb, we mean that he is a Slav -that is, nationally and culturally speaking. But, when we refer to either the slavophone ethnic Macedonians of the north or to the ethnic Albanians of Kosovo and to those within Fyrom, what do we say about their nationality?

Well, to my opinion, both the slavophone ethnic Macedonians of the north and the ethnic Albanians of whichever Albanian land, simply do not constitute of any proper nationality either. Either the ethnic Macedonians are Greek or Slav -be it either of the Bulgarian ethnic stock or of the Serbian one (or are they of a completely different ethnic and national stock be it either Albanian, Romanian, or Turkish). Equally, the same applies to contemporary Albanians, as well. Either they are Greek or Turkish, or Latin or Slav, and so on. Yet, they cannot be simply Albanian or Skipetar. This is only an ethnic or a tribal name, not a national one. Hence, they need to find a stronger and yet, a bigger, nation to belong to. They need a historical-political patron, apart from the one they &#039;ve found already -that is, the American, to keep it short.

Nonetheless, modern-day ethnic Albanians have quite understood that and they attest their glory to the ancient Illyrians, which is conventionally thought to have been that ancient and strong cultural bigger nation that they need today, in order to get by in the modern bourgeois world. Moreover, they struggle really hard to find a single word from their contemporary Graeco-Latin language that could either relate to ancient Illyrian language or neither to ancient Greek or Latin, in order to prove their case, but -still, that effort is also in vain.

Hence, it is to the great historical misfortune to both the so-called slavophone &#039;&#039;ethnic Macedonians&#039;&#039; of the north and to contemporary Albanians (or to the Skipetar people) not to consist of a nation by only themselves, and to close the eye at all times and at all costs to either the Greeks or the Turks, or to the Slavs, or the Italian-Latin peoples, or even to distant peoples that are to be found further than the Atlantic Ocean and in the American continent.

Sooner or later, the ethnic Macedonians of the north will have to chose the nation they consider that is closer to themselves or simply the nation that they seem to think they belong to. The same would also be true for the ethnic Albanians, as well. Modern day Greece is a peripheral sub-imperialist bourgeois nation-state, which agknowledges of that fact very well and awaits for the right moment. The same applies for Turkey, Italy, Serbia, Bulgaria and Romania, as well. The main players for the Albanians are the Greeks, the Italians and the Turks, whereas for the ethnic Macedonians there are the Greeks, the Bulgarians and if they ever regain of their old national strength, the Serbs too.

To that ultimate fight over the historic Macedonian soil it is probably only the Greeks that would stand a significant chance of winning anything at all, if any. The Bulgarians yet they need another fifty years or so, whereas the Serbs are out, still they are not dead yet. Ethnic Macedonian brothers of the north, if you know what it really means to be a Macedonian at all, you need to make a quick and yet a steady choise, and the time is running. You either go for the culture and the nation of your ancient and historic forefathers and ancestors or you opt for your former oppressors and occupiers, the south-Slavs and the Bulgarians. Yet, ethnic Macedonian brothers of the north, you always need to remember that indeed you are not Slavs simply because you happen to speak in nowadays a barbaric and also a foreign Slavic medieval language. 

Since you are also true Macedonians of the original ancient Macedonian stock you &#039;ve got nothing in common with your former oppressors and occupiers of your historic northern Macedonian lands. Indeed, you &#039;ve got more things in common with the indigenous ethnic Macedonian Greeks of the south, as well as with the Romanicized Vlachs (if they really are Greeks or either Greaco-Thracians, as they themselves today assume and also proclaim) and with the ethnic Albanians too (in which case, they also need to prove that they are of an indigenous Graeco-Illyrian ethnic stock or of an at least significant Thracian-Dardanian ethnic stock and cultural origin) than with anyone other ethnic tribe who duells in the Balkans today -and, which may also speak Slav and at the same time also feel Slav or Bulgarian, as well. 

We need not forget either that this particular &#039;&#039;slavophonea&#039;&#039; of yours is nonetheless the byproduct of a centuries&#039; long enslavement to -and, of propaganda and oppression, by- the Slavs and the Bulgarians, whose initially foreign language you have actually obtained at some point in the past, and yet for this or that particular reason of convinience or of survival. 

Indeed, the language that you concurrently speak is not an ancient, nor an indigenous one to the land and to the Macedonian geographical area. Neither is it the language of the original ethnic Macedonians of the old, nor the historic language of Alexander the Great and either of Philippe. Indeed, it is to you only a foreign language and also foreign and barbaric to the sensitive ears of your glorious ethnic Macedonian ancestors, which you have only recently obtained from your former Bulgarian and south-Slavic raiders, invaders, oppressors and occupiers.

Long live the future federal and democratic people&#039;s Hellenic Republic! Long live a united and also a free Macedonia within that new Hellenic Republic! Long live our ethnic Macedonian brothers in the north! Long live ancient Greeks and the ancient Macedonian Greek tribe! Long live the Pelasgians, the Thrako-Illyrians, the Arkadians, the Acheans, the Danaians, the Ionians and the Dorians, the Macedonians and the Epirotans, the Greeks and the historic Hellenes! 

One day the Hellenic Peninsula will be set free again and united into a single Federal Democratic Pan-Hellenic Republic of its Peoples. Indeed, one day soon, we can all become brothers again and free ourselves from oppression and from exploitation of one another. Long live the future Hellenic Republic! Long live the Hellenic Peoples!

Elias L.A.
Athens, Greece.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear ethnic Macedonian brother Bojan / dear fellow Greek readers / dear comrades in arms of the Hellenic Peninsula, </p>
<p>Of course, it is about time that all ethnic minorities in contemporary Greece should have the right to declare themselves as they wish. I fully support their right to do so even though I &#8216;d personaly disagree with the particular choise of the name that those minorities would chose for their own internal and cross-communal daily usage. Moreover, it is about time to understand that there are also many ethnic Macedonians who do not yet speak Greek or who do not speak Greek only and who also do not yet feel Greek at all. Indeed, some of them could even feel in opposition to Greece and to the contemporary Greek bourgeois&#8217; state, which can also oppress them ethnically and socially, by its particular socio-economic way of life and by its politico-historical elite&#8217;s aims and goals, as well as, propaganda and public information system.</p>
<p>It is about time that we modern Greeks see that there are slavophone ethnic Macedonians in our country, who do not feel Greek or Greek only yet. Although I am not one of them -and, not by any means, either- I fully appreciate and completely understand them and their particular need to collectively proclaim of themselves ethnically whatever they wish. It is their absolute democratic right to find a name of their chosing, in order to call themselves and also their community according to that. This is also despite of the fact that I would personaly disagree on scientific and on absolute socio-historic terms and  conditions with the name under perspective, i.e. Ethnic Macedonians.</p>
<p>The reason for my objection is that this is a tribal or an ethnic name, not a name of a nation. Indeed, it takes of more than one ethnic group of people to declare them a separate nation. It is by that token that I significantly object to the use of their ethnic name for stating of their nationality, as well. You cannot be an ethnic Macedonian and also not being a Greek as well -like in the old days. Equally, you cannot in nowadays be an ethnic Macedonian and also not being either a Greek or a Slav, be it either a Serbian Slav or a Bulgarian Slav, or a bit of both also.</p>
<p>Well, of course, one could be a slavophone ethnic Macedonian and yet not at all a Slav of whatever kind (that is, in nationality) or, indeed, one could also be a prime Greek-speaker and yet not at all Greek (also in nationality), either. Moreover, one could not be plain and simply a Macedonian for this is what he declares or because he simply beleives so. That is so, because being an ethnic Macedonian states only his tribal name (i.e. that is, only his ethnic name of birthplace and of origin, and yet nothing more) and not his proper nationality, nor his particular national culture either.</p>
<p>Indeed, it is true that throughout history Macedonia and, in particular Macedonian, were known to have been ethnic Greek names -one of the many tribal or ethnic Greek names that were to be used by the ancient and historic Greek tribes and, also for quite some time in the past. Practically, being a Macedonian did not mean that you were not Greek. As a matter of fact, the opposite was the case. Being a Macedonian in the past also meant that you were Greek, as well. The meaning of the adjective Macedonian has not been a national one but, only a tribal one or an ethnic name of a particular tribe, which belonged to a much larger nation.<br />
,<br />
That has been the case for many centuries before the Avaro-Slavs, the Tataro-Bulgarians, the Antes, the Vindes and the Vendes had ever set foot in the Hellenic Peninsula. When we say today ethnic Bulgarian or an ethnic Serb, we mean that he is a Slav -that is, nationally and culturally speaking. But, when we refer to either the slavophone ethnic Macedonians of the north or to the ethnic Albanians of Kosovo and to those within Fyrom, what do we say about their nationality?</p>
<p>Well, to my opinion, both the slavophone ethnic Macedonians of the north and the ethnic Albanians of whichever Albanian land, simply do not constitute of any proper nationality either. Either the ethnic Macedonians are Greek or Slav -be it either of the Bulgarian ethnic stock or of the Serbian one (or are they of a completely different ethnic and national stock be it either Albanian, Romanian, or Turkish). Equally, the same applies to contemporary Albanians, as well. Either they are Greek or Turkish, or Latin or Slav, and so on. Yet, they cannot be simply Albanian or Skipetar. This is only an ethnic or a tribal name, not a national one. Hence, they need to find a stronger and yet, a bigger, nation to belong to. They need a historical-political patron, apart from the one they &#8216;ve found already -that is, the American, to keep it short.</p>
<p>Nonetheless, modern-day ethnic Albanians have quite understood that and they attest their glory to the ancient Illyrians, which is conventionally thought to have been that ancient and strong cultural bigger nation that they need today, in order to get by in the modern bourgeois world. Moreover, they struggle really hard to find a single word from their contemporary Graeco-Latin language that could either relate to ancient Illyrian language or neither to ancient Greek or Latin, in order to prove their case, but -still, that effort is also in vain.</p>
<p>Hence, it is to the great historical misfortune to both the so-called slavophone &#8221;ethnic Macedonians&#8221; of the north and to contemporary Albanians (or to the Skipetar people) not to consist of a nation by only themselves, and to close the eye at all times and at all costs to either the Greeks or the Turks, or to the Slavs, or the Italian-Latin peoples, or even to distant peoples that are to be found further than the Atlantic Ocean and in the American continent.</p>
<p>Sooner or later, the ethnic Macedonians of the north will have to chose the nation they consider that is closer to themselves or simply the nation that they seem to think they belong to. The same would also be true for the ethnic Albanians, as well. Modern day Greece is a peripheral sub-imperialist bourgeois nation-state, which agknowledges of that fact very well and awaits for the right moment. The same applies for Turkey, Italy, Serbia, Bulgaria and Romania, as well. The main players for the Albanians are the Greeks, the Italians and the Turks, whereas for the ethnic Macedonians there are the Greeks, the Bulgarians and if they ever regain of their old national strength, the Serbs too.</p>
<p>To that ultimate fight over the historic Macedonian soil it is probably only the Greeks that would stand a significant chance of winning anything at all, if any. The Bulgarians yet they need another fifty years or so, whereas the Serbs are out, still they are not dead yet. Ethnic Macedonian brothers of the north, if you know what it really means to be a Macedonian at all, you need to make a quick and yet a steady choise, and the time is running. You either go for the culture and the nation of your ancient and historic forefathers and ancestors or you opt for your former oppressors and occupiers, the south-Slavs and the Bulgarians. Yet, ethnic Macedonian brothers of the north, you always need to remember that indeed you are not Slavs simply because you happen to speak in nowadays a barbaric and also a foreign Slavic medieval language. </p>
<p>Since you are also true Macedonians of the original ancient Macedonian stock you &#8216;ve got nothing in common with your former oppressors and occupiers of your historic northern Macedonian lands. Indeed, you &#8216;ve got more things in common with the indigenous ethnic Macedonian Greeks of the south, as well as with the Romanicized Vlachs (if they really are Greeks or either Greaco-Thracians, as they themselves today assume and also proclaim) and with the ethnic Albanians too (in which case, they also need to prove that they are of an indigenous Graeco-Illyrian ethnic stock or of an at least significant Thracian-Dardanian ethnic stock and cultural origin) than with anyone other ethnic tribe who duells in the Balkans today -and, which may also speak Slav and at the same time also feel Slav or Bulgarian, as well. </p>
<p>We need not forget either that this particular &#8221;slavophonea&#8221; of yours is nonetheless the byproduct of a centuries&#8217; long enslavement to -and, of propaganda and oppression, by- the Slavs and the Bulgarians, whose initially foreign language you have actually obtained at some point in the past, and yet for this or that particular reason of convinience or of survival. </p>
<p>Indeed, the language that you concurrently speak is not an ancient, nor an indigenous one to the land and to the Macedonian geographical area. Neither is it the language of the original ethnic Macedonians of the old, nor the historic language of Alexander the Great and either of Philippe. Indeed, it is to you only a foreign language and also foreign and barbaric to the sensitive ears of your glorious ethnic Macedonian ancestors, which you have only recently obtained from your former Bulgarian and south-Slavic raiders, invaders, oppressors and occupiers.</p>
<p>Long live the future federal and democratic people&#8217;s Hellenic Republic! Long live a united and also a free Macedonia within that new Hellenic Republic! Long live our ethnic Macedonian brothers in the north! Long live ancient Greeks and the ancient Macedonian Greek tribe! Long live the Pelasgians, the Thrako-Illyrians, the Arkadians, the Acheans, the Danaians, the Ionians and the Dorians, the Macedonians and the Epirotans, the Greeks and the historic Hellenes! </p>
<p>One day the Hellenic Peninsula will be set free again and united into a single Federal Democratic Pan-Hellenic Republic of its Peoples. Indeed, one day soon, we can all become brothers again and free ourselves from oppression and from exploitation of one another. Long live the future Hellenic Republic! Long live the Hellenic Peoples!</p>
<p>Elias L.A.<br />
Athens, Greece.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: alex</title>
		<link>http://history-of-macedonia.com/wordpress/2008/09/14/rare-english-map-of-1829-shows-skopje-out-of-macedonia/comment-page-1/#comment-1391</link>
		<dc:creator>alex</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Oct 2008 21:43:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://history-of-macedonia.com/wordpress/?p=664#comment-1391</guid>
		<description>All the different profiles with IP 80.122.174.11 are banned. Stick elsewhere to promote your multiple personality disorder.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All the different profiles with IP 80.122.174.11 are banned. Stick elsewhere to promote your multiple personality disorder.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
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